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Old 15th September 2020, 12.18:30   #811-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

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Originally Posted by WasanActonlad View Post
It's a small world..
Dr Eyton-Jones was on the bench when my great grandfather was brought before the local magistrates court in the 1880's on a charge of assault whilst serving as a PC in the local constabulary..(police brutality is nothing new)..
The damming evidence may have been his colleague a PC Lee's quote " I think you've kicked him too hard PC Pleavin"

This the one WAL?

https://newspapers.library.wales/vie...19/4591527/61/

Last edited by eastsussexred; 15th September 2020 at 12.26:42..
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Old 15th September 2020, 12.53:33   #812-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

That's the one
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Old 15th September 2020, 13.25:59   #813-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

that Mr Murlass sounds a right bundle of laughs
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Old 21st September 2020, 19.04:03   #814-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

It may appear that racing in wrexham did not cease in wrexham prior to WW1...
An advert appeared in the Leader in 1921 promoting a race meeting at the "new racecourse" entrance near the Croesnwydd farm.
That I imagine would be somewhere I imagine between the coedpoeth road and southsea road...
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Old 21st September 2020, 19.08:02   #815-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

In 1921 the racecourse also hosted a women's match between the St Helen's ladies and the famous ladies XI of the era "Dick Kerrs Ladies XI" watched by a crowd of 10500..
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Old 22nd September 2020, 06.55:46   #816-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

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Originally Posted by eastsussexred View Post
Horse racing at The Racecourse was stopped after the 1858 meeting (although Cavalry horse races continued) but it was the birth of the football club, which gave rise to the reintroduction of public horseracing in 1865.
The club was really started as an athletics club; hence the name 'Wrexham Football and Athletics club' and the original members had voted that any profit from football matches should be used to promote athletic sports events in the town. The first athletic Sports event in association with the football club took place on Saturday 13th May 1865, but on Tuesday 7th November of the same year, another athletic sports event was arranged and Galloway races and a sweepstakes were added. While the Athletic Sports events continued at least once annually, the horse racing influence increased year on year until 1873 when The Wrexham Races were completely revived under Jockey Club Rules, and the athletics events began to be seperated into its own meeting.
The races of October 1876 were operated according to Newmarket and Grand National rules, but from 1890 the races were held under British Pony and Galloway Racing Association rules, until the races were finally stopped on The Racecourse, due to a lack of public support after a rainsoaked meeting on 26 August 1912.

On August 6th 1921, The Chester Observer reported that The Wrexham Races (under Midland Racing Club Rules) had been held on a capital new racecourse, on the Rhyd Broughton Estate, on Saturday 30th July. The meeting of 6 races offering £125 in stakes and a cup were well attended, but no more races were reported after this year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WasanActonlad View Post
It may appear that racing in wrexham did not cease in wrexham prior to WW1...
An advert appeared in the Leader in 1921 promoting a race meeting at the "new racecourse" entrance near the Croesnwydd farm.
That I imagine would be somewhere I imagine between the coedpoeth road and southsea road...

It appears to have been a one-off WAL, under the rules of The Midland Racing Club (as above).
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Old 29th September 2020, 11.14:43   #817-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

Confirmation that the house known as The Crispin (from where we get the name of Crispin Lane) was already in existence in 1675.
As previously stated, Ogilby’s road map (1675) shows a substantial un-named house in the exact location where later maps show that The Crispin was located. By overlaying these later maps on Ogiby’s road map, we can see that its location in relation to Plas Coch is the same as it is on later maps, and therefore it has to be the house known as Crispin. But also, the distances recorded on Ogilby’s map in relation to other properties in the area, also confirm that this house was built, either on, or very close to, Wat’s Dyke.
The name ‘stanty’ is recorded just below the house on the 1675 map, which I had originally thought was a misspelling of the name of the township ‘Stansty’. But I have since learned that the word ‘stanty’ was commonly used in the 17th Century to describe a boundary, and so in this case is showing that the house was built on the boundary of Wat’s Dyke.
We also know from A.N. Palmer that the house was owned by a well-known Puritan of the Ambrose Lewis family, from at least 1704 to 1810, but strangely, the house was leased to Robert Williams of Erbistock. From 1731 ‘and for a few years after’.
Robert Williams was the brother of the first Sir Watkin Williams Wynn, as well as Richard Williams of Penbedwr- who was a noted racehorse breeder and stud owner, at that time.
They were all sons of Sir William Williams who had inherited additional extensive estates after his wife (Jane Thelwall) inherited Wynnstay from Sir John Wynn who died in 1719. The family also inherited Plas Coch and the fields on which Y Cae Ras now stands, at the same time, although it would appear that the lower corner of The Racecourse (a field with a diagonal boundary which ran from the house known as The Crispin to the location where the Turf Hotel now stands) may have still been under the ownership of the Ambrose Lewis family in the 18th Century. Later maps indicate this boundary line, which today would run from the railings on the railway side of Crispin Lane from a position opposite where the Yale stand meets the Kop, and then runs diagonally across the lower section of The Racecourse to a point near to the gates outside of The Turf Hotel..
Subsequent land deals, including the land behind the kop, as well as the old Turf Tavern gardens indicate that this section of Y Cae Ras was split into smaller plots and sold off around the start of the 19th Century, possibly after 1810. But the fact that this section of land appears to have been originally owned by the Ambrose Lewis family provides us with a reason for Robert Williams to rent and live at The Crispin, when his family already owned numerous extensive estates throughout North Wales.
The Williams Wynn family started to promote The Wrexham Races ‘on the new course’ around the same time that Robert Williams lived at The Crispin and advertisements were placed in both the Chester and London newspapers from 1738 till 1740 at least. Although the races had been known to have been in existence even earlier, and they would continued in various forms throughout the 18th Century, until Sir Watkin Williams Wynn (5th Baronet) upgraded the course
Attached Images
File Type: jpg John Ogilby's Road Map 1675.jpg (85.7 KB, 17 views)

Last edited by eastsussex; 29th September 2020 at 11.18:22..
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Old 29th September 2020, 11.31:56   #818-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by eastsussex View Post
Confirmation that the house known as The Crispin (from where we get the name of Crispin Lane) was already in existence in 1675.
As previously stated, Ogilby’s road map (1675) shows a substantial un-named house in the exact location where later maps show that The Crispin was located. By overlaying these later maps on Ogiby’s road map, we can see that its location in relation to Plas Coch is the same as it is on later maps, and therefore it has to be the house known as Crispin. But also, the distances recorded on Ogilby’s map in relation to other properties in the area, also confirm that this house was built, either on, or very close to, Wat’s Dyke.
The name ‘stanty’ is recorded just below the house on the 1675 map, which I had originally thought was a misspelling of the name of the township ‘Stansty’. But I have since learned that the word ‘stanty’ was commonly used in the 17th Century to describe a boundary, and so in this case is showing that the house was built on the boundary of Wat’s Dyke.
We also know from A.N. Palmer that the house was owned by a well-known Puritan of the Ambrose Lewis family, from at least 1704 to 1810, but strangely, the house was leased to Robert Williams of Erbistock. From 1731 ‘and for a few years after’.
Robert Williams was the brother of the first Sir Watkin Williams Wynn, as well as Richard Williams of Penbedwr- who was a noted racehorse breeder and stud owner, at that time.
They were all sons of Sir William Williams who had inherited additional extensive estates after his wife (Jane Thelwall) inherited Wynnstay from Sir John Wynn who died in 1719. The family also inherited Plas Coch and the fields on which Y Cae Ras now stands, at the same time, although it would appear that the lower corner of The Racecourse (a field with a diagonal boundary which ran from the house known as The Crispin to the location where the Turf Hotel now stands) may have still been under the ownership of the Ambrose Lewis family in the 18th Century. Later maps indicate this boundary line, which today would run from the railings on the railway side of Crispin Lane from a position opposite where the Yale stand meets the Kop, and then runs diagonally across the lower section of The Racecourse to a point near to the gates outside of The Turf Hotel..
Subsequent land deals, including the land behind the kop, as well as the old Turf Tavern gardens indicate that this section of Y Cae Ras was split into smaller plots and sold off around the start of the 19th Century, possibly after 1810. But the fact that this section of land appears to have been originally owned by the Ambrose Lewis family provides us with a reason for Robert Williams to rent and live at The Crispin, when his family already owned numerous extensive estates throughout North Wales.
The Williams Wynn family started to promote The Wrexham Races ‘on the new course’ around the same time that Robert Williams lived at The Crispin and advertisements were placed in both the Chester and London newspapers from 1738 till 1740 at least. Although the races had been known to have been in existence even earlier, and they would continued in various forms throughout the 18th Century, until Sir Watkin Williams Wynn (5th Baronet) upgraded the course
A possible earlier site for The Wrexham Races may have been 'Eagles Field' which is now known as 'Eagles Meadow' but as the name indicates, this was a meadow and was prone to flooding, and therefore not suitable for horse racing in March when the races of 1739/40 were advertised on 'the new course'. There are a number of newspaper reports of the Eagles Fields flooding throughout the late 18th and 19th Centuries; hence the need for 'a new course'
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Old 1st October 2020, 22.13:57   #819-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

I know it has previously been mentioned there was a possibility of a stadium being built in eagles meadow pre WW1.
There was also interest in developing a greyhound stadium there after WW1.
ESR or as you are now ES you have a pm
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Old 11th October 2020, 17.26:57   #820-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)

I am appealing for a bit of help from anyone who might have access to deeper research tools, or from anyone who can provide information in relation to the final resting place of one of our founding players- George Rumsey Johnston.

George was born into a very well-healed family in Llanbeblig in 1843: His father was an attorney and his mother was a pearl dealer from a successful family who had earned their wealth in the legal profession. The family owned land and property in different parts of North Wales, as well as parts of London, including Oxford Street.

His biography is recorded below.

The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club (Massive history thread!)



I have had some communication with the club with regard to installing a plaque at Y Cae Ras to honour our founding players, but if the fortunes and profile of the club is going to continue to rise (as it now seems that it may) then I will also seek some form of recognition for our founders from WCBC too, as I feel that they may now be a bit more open to promoting the sporting heritage of the town.
Likewise, I am also hoping that Coflein will now re-evaluate their understanding of the history of Y Cae Ras and also re-survey The Turf Hotel, in order to update their records with the correct information. But from a personal perspective, I would like to resolve the issue of the final resting place of George Rumsey Johnston.
He was sent to the Denbigh Lunatic Asylum in 1865 and he remained at the asylum for the next forty seven years of his life; finally being released to an external hospital just a few weeks before he died in 1912.
His asylum records give some indication that his mental health continued to deteriorate to the extent that he was often incoherent, and so it is difficult to even imagine the extent of turmoil in his inner world, let alone the treatment he may have endured in a Victorian Lunatic Asylum. There is also a possibility that he and his sister- Ellen Maude Ramsey Johnston- b.1863 (who also died in the same asylum) may have both been abandoned by their family, due to the stiff Victorian attitudes to mental illness, which was often regarded in terms of a weak moral personality, and therefore, a family embarrassment, which could be locked away and simply forgotten.
Despite his family’s wealth, George had been admitted to the Denbigh Lunatic Asylum as a pauper patient from Bangor&Beaumaris on 09/12/1865, just 14 months after he played in our first ever game and helped to found Wrexham Football and Athletic Club.

The burial records of people who spent most of their lives in Victorian Lunatic Asylums are particularly difficult to find, and so any help would be very much appreciated as I feel that it would be fitting to provide some form of memorial to his life.

Last edited by eastsussex; 11th October 2020 at 17.31:37..
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