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Old 26th October 2016, 10.59:33   #253-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club

Hopefully xmas 2017 then.....
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Old 29th October 2016, 15.23:59   #254-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club

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Originally Posted by eastsussexred View Post
I believe that these John Taylors are all the same person, although I should add that he was the joint founder and secretary of Wrexham Olympic Football Club when Wrexham Football Club reformed in 1884, after being expelled from English football by the English FA for crowd trouble during an FA cup match against Oswestry in December 1883. At the same time he was heavily involved with Wales Football Association and was also the Chairman of The Denbighshire Football Association. I think that the newspaper report of his age when he was sentenced are wrong, and that he was one of our original founding players.
I have emailed the Welsh FA to see if they have more information on John Taylor, but they have not responded; possibly because he was convicted of embezzlement (although not in his football role).
I can now definately confirm that while this John Taylor was secretary to Wrexham Olympic and secretary to The Denbighshire Football Association, who later became Secretary to The Football Association of Wales, he was not the John Taylor who played in our first ever game.
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Old 29th October 2016, 15.27:13   #255-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club

John Taylor was born the son of John and Anne in Wrexham in 1842.
He had one brother- Thomas Buchanan (b 1847) and two sisters- Francis (b 1840) and Anne (b 1845).
His father John (snr) was a town councillor and the landlord of The Swan Inn, Penybryn, where the family brewed their own ale. The family also owned horses which they kept on a field behind the public house and John (snr) served as a clerk for the ponies and riders who needed to register at The Swan Inn before attending race meetings at The Racecourse.
John Taylor (snr) was seriously injured in an accident in 1858, and a few weeks later, while he was recovering, his wife Anne also died. Subsequently, John Taylor (jnr) and his brother, Thomas Buchanan would take a more active role in the running of the business.
In the 1861 census John Taylor (jnr) was listed as the landlord of The Swan Inn, until 1868, when the licence was passed to his brother, Thomas Buchanan, who lived at the premises until The Swan Inn was sold sometime around 1871.
Thomas Buchanan would later earn much acclaim for his athletic prowess, winning many trophies during athletics events at The Racecourse, where he also received The Player of the Season Awards, twice, for Wrexham Football Club during the 1870’s; additionally, he served as the club secretary in the 1880’s through to the 90’s, although, prior to this, his older brother John Taylor (b1842) had been involved in the sporting activities at The Racecourse, where he served as a steward for the Autumn sports events and he may have been a member of The Gentlemen of Denbighshire County Cricket team who also represented North Wales against South Wales in 1867. However, of the two brothers, only John would be old enough to play for the newly formed Wrexham Football Club in their first ever game on 22nd October 1864.
Thomas Buchanan would later follow in his fathers footsteps and serve as a town councillor for many years, while John Taylor appears to have left the area and disappeared from the archives amidst a myriad of John Taylor’s’ until his obituary in The Wrexham Advertiser recorded his death in Newcastle on Tyne at the age of 54 on 17th October 1895.



Articles in The Wrexham Advertiser had earlier reported that John Taylor’s father had been a close friend of Thomas Hanmer (snr) and General Dealer- Ephraim Knibbs (snr).
All three men had associations with The Racecourse and the sons of all 3 men became founding players of Wrexham Football Club.

John Taylor
1842-1895

Last edited by eastsussexred; 29th October 2016 at 15.38:34..
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Old 29th October 2016, 15.34:36   #256-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club

More excellent work ESR...
This'll be some book when it comes out !!!!
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Old 29th October 2016, 15.44:30   #257-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club

John Taylor
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Old 29th October 2016, 16.55:21   #258-0 (permalink)
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Updated list of the 10 founding players of Wrexham Football and Athletic Club.

Charles Edward Kershaw (Captain)
Born 1839. Died Southport 1884.

William Tootell
Born Wrexham 1831. died Wrexham 1866

Thomas Henry Sykes
Born Huddersfield 1841. Died Nottingham 1910

Thomas Broster
Born Wrexham 1845. Died Bethlehem, South Africa 1921

Thomas Hanmer
Born Overton 1839. Died Wrexham 1887

Edward Ephraim Knibbs
Born Chester 1837. Died Wrexham 1875

Thomas Heath
Born Ramsbury (Wilts) 1824. Died Wycombe 1887.

John Taylor
Born Wrexham 1842. Died Newcastle 1895

George R. Johnson

Joseph Roberts
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Old 30th October 2016, 09.17:05   #259-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: The sad case of a founding members and player of Wrexham Football Club

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UNITED VOLUNTEER SERVICE CLUB FOUNDED WREXHAM FOOTBALL CLUB.

While history has recorded that Wrexham Football Club was founded by the members of The Denbighshire Cricket Club, who were seeking sporting activity during the winter months; it was, in-fact, another body, which gave rise to the birth of the football club.

The United Volunteer Service Club was created in 1863 to provide the people of Wrexham an opportunity for sporting activity as an alternative to spending their time in Public Houses.
This club was formed at a time when Wrexham, like other towns of the day, had a very bad reputation for drunkenness, although the town itself was undergoing considerable changes due to commerce and trade, which had brought a significant increase in population to the area.
During this time, different organisations, such as The Council, volunteer groups and various trade bodies were conspiring to build a bigger and better infrastructure for town, while also seeking to alleviate poverty. Moreover, the mood of the time was increasingly being influenced by the church and the likes of The Temperance Movement, who were in direct opposition to the breweries and licensed victuallers, who also held considerable influence in the town.
And so, it was amidst this atmosphere that The United Volunteer Service Club was created in 1863, to provide the people of Wrexham an opportunity for sporting activity as an alternative to spending their time in Public Houses.

The club had originally intended to build a gymnasium, but a lack of funds in its inaugural year had meant that no action could be taken over the first 12 months.

This information came to light whilst I was researching the founding players of Wrexham Football club and can be seen in the following article taken from The Wrexham Advertiser 17 October 1863.

United Volunteer Service Club.
The inauguration dinner was held at the Feathers Inn, on Monday last (12/10/1863) under the presidency of Mr Alderman Evans, who, after the usual loyal toasts had been proposed, gave the toast of the evening, Success to the United Volunteer Service Club," and in the course of his remarks, was pleased to find the young men stirring to provide healthy and instructive amusements for the long winter evenings. He was surprised at the continual denunciation of the growing evil of drunkenness at teetotal meetings and from the pulpits of our Church and Dissenting ministers, when those did not come forward and offer some amusement, such as this club was formed for, and giving the young men of the town pure and healthy amusements. He then called upon Mr E. Morris to explain the objects for which the club had been formed. Mr Morris then said, the desirability has long been felt in Wrexham for some place of amusement during the winter months, where those young men (and there are a great many), who leave their business at six and eight o'clock, would rather go than the public houses, which they frequent at present. The club has been formed for the purpose of providing those games and athletic exercises that will elevate pleasantly the mind and improve physically the body. Being short of funds this year we shall have to be content on our evenings of meeting with open and fair discussion on instructive subjects and elementary games, but he hoped by next winter our funds would be so much increased that we could erect a gymnasium, and take a private room where every young man who wished may go every evening and enjoy himself pleasantly by practising healthy exercises, and keeping him from other immoral practices. Mr Kershaw proposed the Mayor and Corporation, and hoped among other things that waterworks would be provided for the town, either by a private company or by the Corporation, as the drainage would be almost useless without them. The President in responding said he was sorry the town was so heavily burdened with taxes, but he was sure every member of the Council had done that which they thought best for the interests of the town. Mr Manuel Jones in proposing the Town and trade of Wrexham remarked that every necessary improvement was owing to trade. Mr Beirne in responding hoped that the town would increase the next twenty years as much as it had done in the previous. Mr Garnett then proposed the officers of the club, to which Mr Thomas Roberts, High-street, the honorary treasurer and Mr John Williams responded. The Ladies were proposed by Mr John Williams and responded to by Mr J. W. Clark. Mr Allen gave a donation of £1.lshilling to the club, which he is going to repeat annually, we hope others will follow his example. Subscriptions will be received by the treasurer.


WREXHAM COUNTY COURT. I|1863-10-17|Wrexham and Denbighshire Advertiser and Cheshire Shropshire and North Wales Register - Welsh Newspapers Online

Many of the members of The United Volunteer Service Club were also volunteers in The Prince of Wales Fire Brigade and servicemen of The Denbighshire Militia and Cavalry as well as being members of The Denbighshire county Cricket Club.
And so it was that just over a year to the day after announcing their intentions, and having raised funds accordingly, the members of The United Volunteer Service Club would use the annual end of season dinner for The Denbighshire County Cricket Club to bring their ideas to fruition, and consequently give rise to the founding of Wrexham Football club


The end of season meeting of The Denbighshire County Cricket Club, as reported in an article from The Wrexham Advertiser 8th October 1864

THE DINNER. Soon after six o'clock the cricketers and their friends sat down to an excellent spread, prepared by the hostess of the Turf Tavern, who, it may be remarked, did all in her power to keep up her credit in that department, and to render the close of the cricketing season as pleasant as possible. Mr Manners, the worthy secretary of the club, occupied the chair, the vice-chair being filled by Mr Kershaw. On the table being cleared, The Chairman rose and proposed the usual loyal toasts, which were duly honoured. The Chairman then proposed the Army, Navy, Volunteers, and Yeomanry," coupling the name of Mr E. Morris as a volunteer, and Mr Whittaker as belonging to the yeomanry. These gentlemen both readily re- plied and sustained the honour of their respective corps. The Bishop and Clergy of the Diocese" was the next toast, the chairman remarking that he should have proposed them before the army," but it was an omission. The Chairman then gave, in suitable terms, The Members for the Borough and county of Denbighshire." He said-Gentlemen, we have the honour of having two of these gentlemen on our list of patrons-Sir- W. W. Wynn and Mr Mainwaring, but we are sorry we have not got the name of Col. Biddulph. I also call upon the vice-chairman to respond to this toast, as I believe he is an old foxhunter and has followed Sir Watkins’s hounds many a day. The Vice-chairman rose on behalf of the three members" and tendered their thanks, and it is also hoped that this winter a great many of the lovers of the sport would attend Sir Watkins’s hounds, as it was a noble pastime. (Cheers.) The Chairman Gentlemen, In rising to propose the next toast I think it should have fallen to the lot of somebody else. I propose the toast of the evening- Success to the Denbighshire County Cricket Club." j He then read a statement of the accounts of the club, which showed a balance in hand of £6 9s. He said he hoped they were all satisfied with the statement, and they ought to be very glad that the secretary was able to lay before them such a balance sheet (cheers.) There is one thing, gentlemen. I wish to name, the great want of amusement in this town in winter time. It is my intention to purchase a football in the course of this week, and I shall expect a good many down to the field next Saturday. There are other games I should like to introduce, especially a Yorkshire one called knur and spell," a very nice game. It was only yesterday I called upon the Mayor and he said he should like to see an athletic club established in Wrexham (cheers.) If we have athletic sports and cannot obtain a room suitable for holding them in we can have them on the green. (Cheers.) Mr Morris then rose to propose the health of the president and vice-president. They have brought many gentlemen to this club and I hope next year they may be instrumental in bringing a great many more, and I hope we may be as successful in our county matches as we have been with the other matches we have played. I hope our next county matches will be played with energy. I have great pleasure in proposing the health of the president and vice-president of this club (cheers.) Mr Kershaw then said,-Gentlemen, I have a double duty to perform. I have to call upon some one for a song, and to propose a toast. I will eulogise in art brief. a manner as I possibly can. The chairman has been at the helm for many seasons. Now is our opportunity to thank him for having worked so well. There is no doubt if we had nota very excellent secretary or a leader of this club, it would fall to the ground, and we owe him our earnest thanks. Whenever he was short of money he never troubled the treasurer, and the committee were never troubled for funds. Gentlemen, I give von the health of the secretary, and the hon. Secretary Capt. Godfrey. (Loud cheers.) The Chairman rose and said- Gentlemen, give you my thanks for the honour you have done me. I have laboured as much as I could for the club. I should like I to have seen a little more of the committee now and then, but I suppose that they had not the time at their disposal, and as long as they pass the accounts I am quite satisfied, and I hope the committee will give me some assistance in future. There is no one like’s cricket more than I do. Next season I hope we shall be able to have our county matches fixed before the commencement of the season. There may be a great many who will join the club next year, but who will not be proficient enough to play in the county matches, and I hope we may have a separate committee for the purpose of making other minor matches, so that we may have a match every week, and that will bring us up to the mark in proficiency, as we are very short in that respect. I return my sincere thanks for the honour von have done me (cheers.) I conclude with proposing "'1'he Press. It is a toast that cannot be too much honoured, and is one of the noblest institutions of the world, and as there is only one gentleman present who is connected with the press, I have great pleasure in coupling his name with the toast. Mr Robinson from the Advertiser" office returned turned thanks. The health of the host and hostess, and the professional of the club (Mr Sharp) were next proposed and suitably acknowledged, and the rest of the evening was filled up with toast and song.

DENBIGHSHIRE COUNTY CRICKET CLUB.|1864-10-08|Wrexham and Denbighshire Advertiser and Cheshire Shropshire and North Wales Register - Welsh Newspapers Online



As can be seen from the two newspaper articles, the speech made by Edward Manners at The Denbighshire County Cricket Club’s end of season Dinner, links back to the founding speech of The United Volunteer Service Club, and so it is this club which actually gave rise to the founding of Wrexham Football Club
The Wrexham Advertiser responded to the first meeting of The United Volunteer Service Club by placing its own article which called for facilities to be made available for the winter evenings to keep the young men of the town out of public houses.

'A PUBLIC HALL FOR WREXHAM. AT this season of the year, when the evenings set in early, and the continued wet weather, aided by the sewage operations, renders a stroll in the streets anything but pleasant, when cricket matches have ceased, and volunteer exercise has to be practiced in the day, the question forces itself upon the attention of all interested in the mental and moral advancement of the rising generation-what can be done for our young men during the long winter evenings? In seeking a solution of this question, we do not forget that there is in existence a Literary Institute, and an organization for supplying lectures and entertainments, which have been, and will be, a great benefit to the young men of our town. But these do not meet the requirements of a large class, who desire to spend their evenings pleasantly and profitably, simply because they do not supply all the elements of. pleasure and profit rendered necessary by the social habits of our youthful population. Books, magazines, and newspapers are not sufficiently interesting to induce young men to frequent the Reading Room night after night, and lectures are but occasionally available, it is therefore manifest that if those of our population for whom even these means of recreation have been provided, are to be kept from Public Houses, something more must be done on their behalf than has hitherto been attempted. We are glad to see an effort put forth in this direction by the young men themselves in the way of a gymnasium, but the great difficulty is obtaining suitable premises for such purpose, and the necessary funds for proper fittings. And we would remark here, why should Wrexham be so far behind Oswestry in this matter? In that town there is now in course of erection a Public Hall, which will contain, in addition to a Lecture Hall, a gymnasium, reading-rooms, smoking-rooms, and coffee-rooms, everything in point of fact necessary to provide cheap, healthy, and congenial recreation for the young men of the town. This Public Hall is the property of a Joint Stock Company, on the limited liability principle, capital £3,000 in shares, nearly all of which are taken up. Now, without making any invidious comparisons between the towns, we certainly think that every citizen of Wrexham will admit that our progress in population, buildings, wealth, and public spirit has been at any rate equal to that of Oswestry. Then why cannot we do for our sons for our Brymbo tradesmen, citizens, and Town Councillors, that which is being done for the youth of Oswestry? We believe that such an undertaking would be commercially remunerative to investors, and it would be an inestimable boon to our young men. We certainly should like to see the matter taken up by the young men themselves, and we have no doubt that if vigorous and concerted action were taken in the matter, their efforts would be supported by the town, and success would reward their labor.'

I A PUBLIC HALL FOR WREXHAM.I|1863-10-24|Wrexham and Denbighshire Advertiser and Cheshire Shropshire and North Wales Register - Welsh Newspapers Online
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Old 30th October 2016, 09.37:09   #260-0 (permalink)
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^
In effect; what this means is that although Edward Manners was credited with founding Wrexham Football and Athletic Club (and he did play a part in the running of the club) it was, in fact, Charles Edward Kershaw (the first Vice-President of WFAC) and Evan Morris (The first real President of WFAC) who were the real founders of the club.
While they were both members of Wrexham Cricket Club, for which Edward Manners was President; both Kershaw and Manners founded The United Volunteer Service Club outside of their roles in the cricket club, specifically to create winter athletic sports for the town of Wrexham.
Edward Manners then responded by buying a football for the cricket club, but his passion remained more with cricket, whereas Kershaw and Morris focussed more on winter athletics and particularly, the football club.
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Old 5th November 2016, 12.35:10   #261-0 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by WasanActonlad View Post
What you are doing is more than applaudable....
Maybe I'm showing my age and era re our high tech era.

At least there should be a revised edition of the club history book ... accounting for the previous unrecorded (what you have now done) period 1864-1872.

Oh for someone to stumble upon within their attic of unknown minutes of agm's during the first 20 years....
Really curious to understand why reporting of club events is sketchy in local press till about 1872...
I had noted this post when you mentioned it WAL and put it on a list of to-do's, as I was also curious as to why the newspaper archives have a blank period regarding games played by the club during our early years,


It seems most likely 'to me' that the reason no games were reported for the 1869/70, 1870/71 and 1871/72 seasons, is due to the fact that we didn't have a ground to play on.
I have trawled both the Welsh and British newspaper archives and found that our last game of the 1868/69 season was a drawn game at Ruabon, on March 6th, with the team being made up almost entirely of Provincial Insurance Office clerks.
Unusually, there was then no mention of Wrexham Football Club in The Denbighshire County Cricket Clubs start of season dinner, soon after (these dinners were like the AGM's of today).
This break in our recorded history seems to have come about due to The Denbighshire Yeomanry Cavalry having stopped training at The Racecourse back in 1863, with their training base having been moved to Denbigh;- most likely because Wrexham had too many pubs and the servicemen were getting drunk and missing training.
Then in June 1870, the cavalry returned to Wrexham for the first time in 7 years to take part in a display on Eagles fields before assembling on the Racecourse for manoevers the following day.
The Racecourse had been placed at their disposal again, by Sir Watkin Williams Wynn, who had also had the course adapted, with hedges taken down, specifically to accomodate the cavalry and militia's training needs.
The leaders of the local militia and cavalry regiments then met at The Turf Hotel in September 1870 (a month before the football season was due to start) to confirm that the regiments would be returning to The Racecourse. Later that month, the annual Autumn Sports Meeting took place, but there were no more reports of Wrexham Football Club until January of 1873.
During this period- the 1869/70,1870/71 and 1871/72 seasons, newspapers continued to report cricket matches, miners meetings, race meetings and military gatherings on The Racecourse, but no football, and so it would seem likely that the football club was forced to give way to military needs and eventually negotiated a return to their spiritual home for the 1872/73 season, with a game against Ruabon Rovers being advertised to take place on 25th January 1873.
There are references to most of the people who played for the club, although in their various different roles at The Racecourse throughout the these seasons, such as TB Taylor winning prizes in competitions for The Denbighshire Yeomanry Cavalry, and the likes of C.E. Kershaw in his role as a steward and clerk for Athletic Sports meetings etc... but no references to football. And so the club may well have become a bit more informal during this period, and would likely have played scratch matches etc... possibly in different locations, but these were not reported in the press, though the club who returned to play at The Racecourse in 1873, were the same club, with the same names and faces as those who last played at The Racecourse in 1869.

Last edited by eastsussexred; 5th November 2016 at 12.39:55..
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