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Old 9th June 2019, 16.31:58   #11-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Football club ownership model

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Originally Posted by JonWrexhamfc View Post
Could think of nothing worse than Wrexham council owning a percentage of Wrexham football club.
I have to agree. Close working to the benefit of each other, yes. An actual say in the running. No thanks.
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Old 9th June 2019, 16.34:02   #12-0 (permalink)
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I notice you havenít chosen his point about fans ownership on its own not having the money to keep clubs going.
He doesn't say that?

" I donít think, in the majority of cases and in the current environment, that they can raise the money to keep a club going, whereas councils are a major part of the context in which clubs live."

So that implies there is a minority out there that can?

I quoted the bit I found interesting, and bonkers.

Schools not having books, care homes closing, bin collections getting longer, roads in a poor state... but councils should step up and fill the funding/ownership gaps to help pay thousands to journeymen rubbish to train for a few hours a day and sit on a bench on a Saturday? Not for me, Clive.
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Old 9th June 2019, 16.34:30   #13-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Football club ownership model

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Originally Posted by Inside Left View Post
Local Councils have far more important priorities than shoring up weak entertainment businesses.
A council can facilitate a lot more than just money though.
First and foremost is land and its availability.
Then protection and even in some cases compulsory purchase.
Representation at WAG, FAW and other bodies and so on.

Success usually comes from partnerships and working together and failures from the opposite. Many current examples of both showing at the moment.

Currently there are talks but thats all they seem to be.
No structure or shareable plans to be seen anywhere.

Fan ownership doesnt seem applicable as we dont have a share and it seems an annual membership system. I have no problems paying annual membership and more than current model but I would like a tangible share or something. Dont even want a return from it just to know I am an owner
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Old 9th June 2019, 16.35:54   #14-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Football club ownership model

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Originally Posted by Rob View Post
He doesn't say that?

" I donít think, in the majority of cases and in the current environment, that they can raise the money to keep a club going, whereas councils are a major part of the context in which clubs live."

So that implies there is a minority out there that can?

I quoted the bit I found interesting, and bonkers.

Schools not having books, care homes closing, bin collections getting longer, roads in a poor state... but councils should step up and fill the funding/ownership gaps to help pay thousands to journeymen rubbish to train for a few hours a day and sit on a bench on a Saturday? Not for me, Clive.

Palios said: "Fan ownership is good but I recognise that the vehicles used at the moment are difficult to manage and rely on vagaries of the agendas of individuals that may at any moment head off in a different direction. I donít think, in the majority of cases and in the current environment, that they can raise the money to keep a club going, whereas councils are a major part of the context in which clubs live."
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Old 9th June 2019, 17.41:49   #15-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Football club ownership model

Perhaps if he hadn't thrown money at Tranmere, I might be more interested in what he says.
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Old 9th June 2019, 18.08:15   #16-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Football club ownership model

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Originally Posted by Foxy View Post
Palios said: "Fan ownership is good but I recognise that the vehicles used at the moment are difficult to manage and rely on vagaries of the agendas of individuals that may at any moment head off in a different direction. I donít think, in the majority of cases and in the current environment, that they can raise the money to keep a club going, whereas councils are a major part of the context in which clubs live."
'In the majority of cases ' -does success of that possibly depend more on the fan support numbers ???
Despite the councils track record -I actually dont mind the idea of the council being a part owner -as that may mean support for the kop development or training facilities ?
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Old 9th June 2019, 18.16:18   #17-0 (permalink)
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I think the first thing the WCBC could and should do is contribute to annual stadium rent costs. After all they are partly responsible for us not getting any money from flats.
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Old 9th June 2019, 19.01:14   #18-0 (permalink)
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'In the majority of cases ' -does success of that possibly depend more on the fan support numbers ???
Despite the councils track record -I actually dont mind the idea of the council being a part owner -as that may mean support for the kop development or training facilities ?
It would yes. Clearly Barcelona are sort of fans owned, but with their numbers and a global profile (coupled with the fact that they are essentially a Catalan national side) they can be very prolific. Our fans support is enough to make us competitive at National League Level , hence every season we start off with a hope of the play offs. But at any level above this , our limited number of fans makes fans ownership increasingly likely to fail. Hence the point I have been making (accurately and with much personal abuse) for 6 years now....

Fans ownership under a good and lucky manager may get us up BUT IN THE LONG RUN FANS OWNERSHIP WILL FAIL.
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Old 9th June 2019, 19.10:44   #19-0 (permalink)
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It would yes. Clearly Barcelona are sort of fans owned, but with their numbers and a global profile (coupled with the fact that they are essentially a Catalan national side) they can be very prolific. Our fans support is enough to make us competitive at National League Level , hence every season we start off with a hope of the play offs. But at any level above this , our limited number of fans makes fans ownership increasingly likely to fail. Hence the point I have been making (accurately and with much personal abuse) for 6 years now....

Fans ownership under a good and lucky manager may get us up BUT IN THE LONG RUN FANS OWNERSHIP WILL FAIL.
Wycombe, AFC Wimbledon, Exeter and Newport seem to be doing OK. And Iíd argue we have bigger support and more potential than all of them...
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Old 9th June 2019, 19.11:45   #20-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Football club ownership model

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxy View Post
It would yes. Clearly Barcelona are sort of fans owned, but with their numbers and a global profile (coupled with the fact that they are essentially a Catalan national side) they can be very prolific. Our fans support is enough to make us competitive at National League Level , hence every season we start off with a hope of the play offs. But at any level above this , our limited number of fans makes fans ownership increasingly likely to fail. Hence the point I have been making (accurately and with much personal abuse) for 6 years now....

Fans ownership under a good and lucky manager may get us up BUT IN THE LONG RUN FANS OWNERSHIP WILL FAIL.
just because you and Palios say something it doesn't make it correct or accurate. What does "FAIL" mean then ? and in what context and timescale ? I, and many others think you (and Palios) are wrong in this.
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