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Old 2nd August 2020, 15.40:26   #1-0 (permalink)
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Default Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

As a lifelong wrexham fan I have enjoyed reading red passion over the years and in conversation with fellow supporters I know we often observe that whilst there is often abusive and seemingly misinformed or highly judgemental commentary there are also some really well informed and knowledgeable contributions.

Based on that, in the past I have tended to see it as a good barometer of the opinions of Wrexham fans about a range of topics.

However I am now left questioning this stance. Reading this forum in advance of the EGM it would seem that the prevailing views were against the motion for the Groves whilst in fact it won by a ratio of nigh on 3-1.

I am left wondering if the views expressed on RP are really now just those of extreme views about Wrexham FC ? I also wonder if itís value as a genuine forum for debate has disappeared perhaps due to the abusive and judgemental nature of some of the comments on here.

For me that is a shame - I wonder if there are others out there (especially those who read more than post) who feel the same ?
Old 2nd August 2020, 15.47:51   #2-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

As a Democrat, I accept yesterdayís vote. How could I Rgue against it? As a Trust member I didnít get a chance to vote (where is that e mail?) and that annoys me and my lad.
The result,was obviously the poll of those honoured to vote. As most WAFC fans are not trust members, I still feel that the grass roots feeling is that the money set aside to create a training facility at the Groves, would be better spent boosting the playing squad and getting off this god foresaken league. If fans donít join the Trust, they cannot moan - unlike me!
Life is all about opinions. There is a time and place to voice them.
Old 2nd August 2020, 15.48:29   #3-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

No, the club is.
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Old 2nd August 2020, 17.19:25   #4-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicCol View Post
As a lifelong wrexham fan I have enjoyed reading red passion over the years and in conversation with fellow supporters I know we often observe that whilst there is often abusive and seemingly misinformed or highly judgemental commentary there are also some really well informed and knowledgeable contributions.

Based on that, in the past I have tended to see it as a good barometer of the opinions of Wrexham fans about a range of topics.

However I am now left questioning this stance. Reading this forum in advance of the EGM it would seem that the prevailing views were against the motion for the Groves whilst in fact it won by a ratio of nigh on 3-1.

I am left wondering if the views expressed on RP are really now just those of extreme views about Wrexham FC ? I also wonder if itís value as a genuine forum for debate has disappeared perhaps due to the abusive and judgemental nature of some of the comments on here.

For me that is a shame - I wonder if there are others out there (especially those who read more than post) who feel the same ?
I don't think it's a good barometer. I think people who post on here are more aware of things going on such as the failure to act on democratically-voted on motions, and the board signing off on minutes which they stated "Concerns were voiced regarding Mr Bircham acting without informing the board and there was a feeling that we need to check transactions from that era", even though they later stated that "Following the brief publication of unredacted minutes from the Trust Board meeting of 20th May 2020, the Society Board of Wrexham Supporters Trust would like to clarify that Don Bircham is not being investigated into anything to do with Football Club matters, including the breach of the Board Members Policy.

We apologise to Don for his name being mentioned in this section, which caused this impression. Peter Jones, Chairman of the WST, has also called Don to offer his apologies in person.

Further to this, and following the investigation into the club accounts in regards to the three loans made, the Society Board are satisfied that the interest-free loans made by Don to the Football Club, were made with other Directorsí knowledge and in the best interest of the Football Club at the time."

For me, if you're aware of all of these things, you're probably less likely to have full faith in the current board.

As to your last point - I definitely think some people could be less judgemental. I'm still happier debating on here than on other forums where people's addresses have been posted by those who disagree with them, which seems massively intimidating to me; I don't think anyone on RP would stoop that low.
Old 2nd August 2020, 17.27:28   #5-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

What exactly is extremist in not approving of the things that have gone on. When listed, it's difficult to actually argue against what people are not happy about.
Old 2nd August 2020, 17.39:17   #6-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

If im not happy about something i will express my view. Do i think the club is being run badly and is rapidly going under.? Yes. Do people disagree with that view? Yes.

We will see in two years time where the club is and my extreme views are right or not.
Old 2nd August 2020, 17.46:48   #7-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

People have different views. An "extreme" view to me are people who don't want to even entertain potential bidders, likewise the opposite extreme would be wanting to sell to the first bidder who flashed their cash in our direction without due diligence.

People here are more up to date with the goings-on regarding the board and the football club than your average fan. You'll find that in any online forum, whether it be one about a sports club, a TV show or anything.

On sites like Reddit there's very niche communities (you could spend hours on there finding fanbases for stuff you didn't even know existed) that are up to date with whatever they follow, and therefore have more passionate views about their chosen subject. Does that lead to some obnoxious debate? Most definitely. But it can also lead to more informed discussion.

Last edited by Lods; 2nd August 2020 at 17.47:57..
Old 2nd August 2020, 17.47:50   #8-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicCol View Post
As a lifelong wrexham fan I have enjoyed reading red passion over the years and in conversation with fellow supporters I know we often observe that whilst there is often abusive and seemingly misinformed or highly judgemental commentary there are also some really well informed and knowledgeable contributions.

Based on that, in the past I have tended to see it as a good barometer of the opinions of Wrexham fans about a range of topics.

However I am now left questioning this stance. Reading this forum in advance of the EGM it would seem that the prevailing views were against the motion for the Groves whilst in fact it won by a ratio of nigh on 3-1.

I am left wondering if the views expressed on RP are really now just those of extreme views about Wrexham FC ? I also wonder if itís value as a genuine forum for debate has disappeared perhaps due to the abusive and judgemental nature of some of the comments on here.

For me that is a shame - I wonder if there are others out there (especially those who read more than post) who feel the same ?
Listened through the whole presentation. Would have voted positively. Then realised I had not been sent the voting code!
Old 2nd August 2020, 17.48:47   #9-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaded View Post
I don't think it's a good barometer. I think people who post on here are more aware of things going
I thought I would have a quick nose at one method of how people can find out what is going on, by reading the minutes, and what the data says on that.

Helpfully the WST site says how many people have downloaded the minutes PDF

October 2019 - 91 downloads
November 2019 - 43 downloads
December 2019 - 94 downloads
January 2020 - 32 downloads
February 2020 - 18 downloads
March 2020 - 48 downloads
April 2020 - 34 downloads
May 2020 - 59 downloads
June 2020 - 181 downloads


In recent times the contents are of course shared on here on several threads, and it is possible the PDFs are shared many times again elsewhere.

If there are 400 voting people I would guess many are not seeing the ins and outs of what is infact going on.

For reference the EGM presentation had 604 downloads, the resolution document itself had 136 downloads, and the appendices just 37 and 29 downloads.

How the EGM presentation document was shared should be looked at for all documents, as it obviously worked (it alone was downloaded more times than all those minutes listed above put together!). What is the difference, did that get a mass email out and minutes just appear on the site?
Old 3rd August 2020, 09.32:43   #10-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Is Red Passion just a forum for extremists now!

I certainly wouldn't class myself as an extremist, rather a lifelong supporter demanding much needed change!
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