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Old 18th November 2023, 12.09:13   #55-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

Populist, flag waving, nationalist, culture war stuff.

Don't forget the Nats have already “rebranded” Wxm FC’s nickname away from The Robins and sacked Rockin’ Robin with replaced it with a dragon.

On the plus side, Wxm’s FC’s neighbour’s have changed their name from The Meibion Glyndwr University to Wrexham / Wrecsam.
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Old 18th November 2023, 12.21:45   #56-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red-C View Post

As mentioned earlier for what I understand the earliest Cymraeg versions of Wrexham are actually Gwregsam or Gwrecsam and I think that is much cooler anyway.
The Dictionary of the Place Names of Wales gives plenty of spellings to play with. (I can't figure out how to show this image except as an attachment.)
Attached Images
File Type: jpeg IMG_0795.jpeg (435.7 KB, 20 views)
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Old 18th November 2023, 13.07:15   #57-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

For those who hate how Wales is run. Well, there's always more of this.
https://twitter.com/larryandpaul/sta...lCwgJ1miFyiwGQ
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Old 18th November 2023, 13.20:30   #58-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodigal Dragon View Post
It would be interesting to discover when the Welsh derivative of ‘Wrecsam’ was first used.

We were the ‘wrong side’ of Offa’s Dyke, so Wryhtelhamm has a certain Anglo-Saxon ring to it! Purely for historical accuracy, of course!
Afternoon PD.

Wristlesha’ 1161 (the letter ‘m’ had worn away by the time that the text was rediscovered)
Wrexham 1186
wrechtessham 1200/01
Wrixham 1200-07
Wrechcessam 1222 (1295)
Wrettesham or Wrectesham 1236 (Alfred Neobard Palmer)
Gwrexam 1254
Wyrcesson 1291 (Alfred Neobard Palmer)
Gwregsam 1291 or later
Wrightesham 1294
Wrythelsham 1294
Wrechtessham 1294
Wrightlesham 1316-7 (Alfred Neobard Palmer)
Gwerexham 1366
Wrixham 1416
Wrexham 1536-39 (with a footnote that stated that it was ‘treuly caullid’ (truly called) ‘Wrightelsham’.
Wrexham Vaure 1563/64 (vaure is a corruption of the Welsh word ‘Fawr’ meaning big/large area)
Gwreksam c1570
Gwrexham 1699

It should be noted that most of the population was illiterate in the Middle Ages and the people who recorded the name of the town might never have seen the name written before, but were instead interpreting the spelling of the name, which had been given to them by word of mouth.

The Great Survey ‘Domesday Book’ (1086) lists all of the occupied land in England and parts of Wales; telling us who owned the land prior to 1066, who owned it in 1086, and often telling us how and when it changed hands. While the area that would come to be known as the town of Wrexham was not recorded in the book, many other local settlements were recorded, and from the details that were recorded in The Domesday Book, it can be ascertained that when the survey was taken, land to the western (Racecourse) side of Wat’s Dyke was being governed according to Welsh tradition and law, while the land to eastern (town side) of the dyke was still being governed under Anglo-Saxon law. The Normans referred to the land to the west of Wat’s Dyke (Racecourse side) as ‘Pura Wallia’ and the disputed land to the east (town side) of the dyke as ‘Marchia Walliae’ – the Welsh Marches.

Additionally, the etymology of many of the place names in the region are of Anglo Saxon origin, such as Gresford (Anglo-Saxon ‘Graes’ and ‘ford’ meaning ‘grassy ford’) Hoseley (Anglo-Saxon ‘Oda or Hoda’s Lea’ meaning ‘Oda’s meadow’) Sutton (Anglo-Saxon ‘sudh, soth or suo’ meaning ‘south’ and ‘ton/tun’ meaning ‘farm or homestead’) Eyton (Anglo-Saxon ‘ea’ meaning ‘river’ and ‘ton/tun’ which translates as ‘homestead on the river’) Marford (Anglo-Saxon ‘Mere or mearc’ and ‘ford’ meaning ‘boundary at a crossing of the river’) and Stansty from the Anglo-Saxon word ‘stan’ meaning ‘stone’ and ‘sti’ or ‘sty’ relating to a road, pathway or enclosure, etc. All of this adds a great deal of weight to the widely held view that the Anglo Saxon Mercians established their own settlements in the sparsely occupied areas of the former tribal lands of The Cornovii (later, the proto Kingdom of Powys) as they expanded along the river systems from the east, until the Mercian king ‘Offa’ and his ascendants, consolidated their control of the area with the defensive embankment and ditch that is now known as Offa’s Dyke.


Likewise, the original name of the town of Wrexham appears to have been derived from the Anglo Saxon 'water meadow of Wryhtel'- Wryhtel's Hamm (Wrightelsham)
Wryhtel was an anglo saxon personal name, which later evolved into the surname 'Wright', such as shipwright or playwright, so that Wryhtel may have been an anglo saxon craftsman who established a settlement in the meadows that lined the banks of the river Gwenfro, as the anglo saxons were known to have established settlements along the rivers as they expanded across Britain.
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Old 18th November 2023, 14.42:34   #59-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

Just go all out on sponsorship and or for greggsam
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Old 18th November 2023, 14.43:34   #60-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

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Originally Posted by welshian View Post
Just go all out on sponsorship and or for greggsam
Good call
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Old 18th November 2023, 15.04:55   #61-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

I can understand why they want to preserve the heritage and language but as others have pointed out it’s quite clearly a Saxon name originally. It seems that anything invented after about 1800 the Welsh have just used the English but spelt as if it was said in Welsh eg television, siop, etc a bit like Julio Geordio speak from Harry Enfield.
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Old 18th November 2023, 15.18:30   #62-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

Glad the welsh assembly is working on important issues.
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Old 18th November 2023, 18.17:11   #63-0 (permalink)
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Default Re: Wrecsam AFC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiddy Dragon View Post
Another lunatic idea from the Senedd backed by a petition of 1400 presented to the Welsh Parliament, by linguist Mihangel ap Rhisiart.

In the Welsh language, the city's title is spelled Wrecsam . It is one of several places across the country that could face a change, including tourist towns Barry and Caerphilly, which may soon be known as Barri and Caerfilli .

If the petition proves successful, Wrexham would be the club most affected by such a change. Championship teams Cardiff City and Swansea City, plus Wrexham's League Two rivals Newport County, do not face the same uncertainly as the Welsh names of those three cities are deemed too different from their English spellings.

Who employs these people, have they nothing more useful to do with their time?
And somebody is voting for them! A few on here by their posts!
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